Pavonis Interactive Forums

So, we all know that grenades reduce mobility by one when you take them on a mission. But, does this effect your mobility for the entire mission, or do you regain that mobility point once you have thrown the grenade? Logic would dictate the latter, though good gameplay would insist on the former.

No you dont regain the mobility. The weight of the grenade is replaced with the crushing mental weight of witnessing living creatures getting blown apart by that very grenade so it evens out

You don't get refunded the mobility. It helps if you look at it from a game perspective instead of a simulationist one. The basic rule of inventory in XCOM is that you can add optional powers to your soldiers, but you pay -1 mobility for each option you take. Things like ammo, which replaces existing ammo and logically shouldn't increase weight, make more sense when you think of it as taking up gameplay space rather than physical weight. Grenades are single use items, sure, but having that option transforms how you use the soldier. You don't get the mobility back when you use it, but the aliens don't get their people back either, so it's okay. Grenades also apparently weigh less if you're a Grenadier, but again, from a gamist perspective, that's just a special discount that that particular class gets when taking that particular option.

Is it actually possible to mod in the increase of mobility after using one-shot items? I think it would be good for realism (yes I know, in a game about repelling an alien invasion)

Antifringe wrote:You don't get refunded the mobility. It helps if you look at it from a game perspective instead of a simulationist one. The basic rule of inventory in XCOM is that you can add optional powers to your soldiers, but you pay -1 mobility for each option you take. Things like ammo, which replaces existing ammo and logically shouldn't increase weight, make more sense when you think of it as taking up gameplay space rather than physical weight. Grenades are single use items, sure, but having that option transforms how you use the soldier. You don't get the mobility back when you use it, but the aliens don't get their people back either, so it's okay. Grenades also apparently weigh less if you're a Grenadier, but again, from a gamist perspective, that's just a special discount that that particular class gets when taking that particular option.

That's great, but grenades are a limited resource, unlite ammo, vest, mindshield, etc. Because of that downside(you can run out of grenades, duh) IMO you should get something in return(get back mobility). A grenadier without grenades is a rookie with better stats, so at least let that rookie have some extra mobility.

Personally I just removed grenade and ammo weights altogether. This was mostly sparked by smoker/flashbanger perks actually slowing you down, so I said to hell with it, that's going away now.

I kept weight for everything else; pistols, vests, etc.

cerebrawl wrote:Personally I just removed grenade and ammo weights altogether. This was mostly sparked by smoker/flashbanger perks actually slowing you down, so I said to hell with it, that's going away now.

I kept weight for everything else; pistols, vests, etc.

Wait WHAT! You get the mobility penalty for the "free" smokes/flashbangs?

Didn't know that...

I've heard that a lot of people DON'T experience any mobility hindrance from Smoker/Flashbanger. I'm about to test it in my game, so I'll know for sure in a few minutes.

Jarlek wrote:

cerebrawl wrote:Personally I just removed grenade and ammo weights altogether. This was mostly sparked by smoker/flashbanger perks actually slowing you down, so I said to hell with it, that's going away now.

I kept weight for everything else; pistols, vests, etc.

Wait WHAT! You get the mobility penalty for the "free" smokes/flashbangs?

Didn't know that...

JL confirmed that it's happening but that it's not intended. There will be no penalty for carrying them in 1.2.

cerebrawl wrote:Personally I just removed grenade and ammo weights altogether. This was mostly sparked by smoker/flashbanger perks actually slowing you down, so I said to hell with it, that's going away now.

I kept weight for everything else; pistols, vests, etc.

I would like to mod it down, but not out. Unfortunately, the weight=1 is rather a big jump down to zero with not much in between (in terms of integers). Grenades are not *that* heavy and should not slow someone down that much, maybe a grenade *launcher*, but not a single grenade.

I know some people are more into the game-balance--trade mobility for fire power idea---but I'm always of the opinion that it should make sense. If it doesn't and it's still a problem, find another way to balance it that makes sense rather than hammering wacky game mechanics into the game design. For example, why wouldn't the free flashbang grenade require weight, but one you *choose* to carry does. I agree with not forcing the weight on the player, but I'm just making a point. You're still carrying it either way, right? (On a side note, how can throwing a grenade have a "cool down" in real combat?)

I really wish they (Firaxis or Pavonis) had used a strength parameter. I understand bulk, but if he's strong enough to lug it around, the mobility penalty should not be that much, especially for a low-weight grenade compared to rifles and armor.

I have never liked the mobility penalty either, and I always mod that option out. It doesn't feel like it is given you hard strategic choices. It just feels like it is punishing you for everything. Especially with the assault. The assault I found useless if he was carrying anything as he could not flank anybody. So in stead of customizing assaults in different ways, their equipment was always the same (plating and that was about it) This doesn't add choices. it takes them away.

And it doesn't fit reality. According to the game logic a big strong fireman wouldn't be able to carry very much, but a slim fast guy would be able to carry all sorts of things.

The fact is I expect the soldiers to be conditioned to carry weight needed by their class. Assaults especially would be conditioned to run in heavy equipment. The fact that gunners have a big gun is already balanced by the fact they only have a small knife as secondary. The fact that soldiers only have 3 slots would be because that is what they are conditioned to carry.


And I removed all weight modifiers and changed the smg so that instead of providing a mobility bonus , it is a gun that is usefull by highly mobile or stealthy people. (high accuracy close up, but less accurate at range) That way a characters mobility is their speed and not how much they can carry, and you can give characters equipment that are appropriate to their mobility level. smgs and damage grenades to low aim but fast people, slow people are better with smoke grenades and rifles. Much more options and flexibility that way.

The reality isn't much better. Sure, grenades don't weight that much. But each soldier is carrying about 200-300 rounds of extra ammo as well as 1 or 2 belts for the LMG's.

Gameplay wise, looks like Pavonis upped Mobility from stock XCOM 2, which was 12, and made it 15. And took some of it away if you carry both a rifle or a shotgun and items.

I'm still tempted to mod out their weight effect.

gormack82 wrote:No you dont regain the mobility. The weight of the grenade is replaced with the crushing mental weight of witnessing living creatures getting blown apart by that very grenade so it evens out

xD Adorable.

dang it... so, the smoke grenade and the flash grenade perks count as weight against the soldier... well that just screwed my whole reason for getting the damn things...

soooo, next question would be: how does one go about modding the damn grenades to zero then... sheesh.

If you set the grenades in the config files to zero weight it would remove the weight penalty. But that would include all grenades, including the ones in your inventory.

But it is a bug that those perks work that way (they aren't supposed to add the weight.) It will be fixed next patch form my understanding.