Idea for making AWC perks more fun and balanced

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DaviBones
Posts: 75
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 8:30 pm

Idea for making AWC perks more fun and balanced

Post by DaviBones »

Introduction
Perk trees in the AWC are highly variant. Sometimes, you will get three perks of little to no use. Other times, you will get an incredibly powerful combination, which, while fun, can sometimes even outshine other classes. Still other times, two amazing non-grenade perks will be hiding behind Boosted Cores. Many people have suggested doing away with some or all of the grenade perks. To me, that is merely fixing a symptom of the larger problem that there are perhaps too many possibilities. I have an idea to remedy this and simultaneously make each soldier more unique and memorable. (Note: Pistol perks are fine, and are not included in this discussion.)

The Solution
The idea is quite simple: Instead of having entirely random perks, there could be a number of pre-defined perk "sets" that fulfill a particular role (I will call these sets "subclasses" from here onward). These subclasses would be limited to particular soldier classes and would be designed such that they generally fill the role of a non class build. Let me give some examples to help illustrate what I mean:

Smoker -- Deploys smoke where needed with low action economy, but not as well as a dedicated Support Grenadier.
Level 1: Smoker
Level 2: Rapid Deployment
Level 3: Full Kit

Lobber -- Great for those "I need a frag/flashbang right here, right now" moments.
Level 1: Salvo
Level 2: Volatile mix
Level 3: Bombard

Marksman -- A rifleman at his best on high ground. Basically makes non-shooty classes more shooty.
Level 1: Damn Good Ground
Level 2: Low Profile
Level 3: Center Mass/Hunter's Instinct

Skirmisher -- Great for flanking.
Level 1: Deadshot/Sprinter
Level 2: Hunter's Instinct
Level 3: Hit and Run

Rogue -- A sneaky sneaker that can substitute for a Shinobi in a pinch.
Level 1: Covert
Level 2: Ghostwalker
Level 3: Phantom

Having subclasses like this would not only fix the over-randomization of the current AWC, it would weaken the "one-class-one-build" mentality, and would make soldiers unique enough that putting together a squad with good synergy would be even more engaging. Also, I'm sure many of you have had moments of "oh yeah, [Insert Soldier Name Here] has Low Profile from the AWC... Wish I had remembered that before I had him bogart all the full cover every mission." Well, I think that having these subclasses will make AWC perks in general more memorable. It is easier to remember perks when they have a defined synergy.

And now, on to the proverbial mutton in the room...

Balance
"Is this even balanced?!" I hear you cry. Shouts of "That's a huge buff for XCOM!" and "NEEDS NERF!" from the more masochistic among us (read: all of us) echo all around. Well you're probably right. It would likely need a bit of balancing. However, I think the first big step to doing that is to remove the most powerful perks from the AWC entirely, leaving them to be more unique to their original classes. Alternatively, they could be very rarely included as the final perk of a subclass; for instance, the example "Rogue" subclass above could very rarely include Conceal instead of Phantom. Here is a mostly exhaustive list of the perks that gots to GO if this system were implemented:
  • Serial
  • Rupture
  • Cyclic Fire
  • Light 'Em Up
  • Reaper
  • Conceal
  • Hail of Bullets (arguable)
  • Lethal (arguable)
  • Close Combat Specialist (arguable)
Other Issues
There are two main issues to be discussed other than balance. The first is meta-gaming. With pre-defined subclasses, a thorough list of them would invariably end up on ufopaedia, allowing people to guess their subclass just from the first perk. There are a few possible solutions. First, design the subclasses so that the first perk appears in several subclasses, so that meta-gaming can only narrow it down so much. Second, keep the entire perk tree hidden until the first perk is trained, at which point the entire perk tree is revealed. The first perk of every subclass would have to be universally useful, and the UI would have to be recoded slightly. Of course, the third solution is to just not worry about it, if people want to meta-game, let them meta-game.

The second issue is the fact that there are two perk trees. Many of these subclasses would be best with a mix of offensive and defensive perks. So is it better to have two unlockable subclasses? Or is it better to have just one, with six perks instead of three (seems like a lot of perks for a subclass, since a primary class has only a few more than that)? Or, are both those options too powerful? One of the trees could be dedicated to the subclass, while the other could just shuffle all the perks that don't really fit a specific role, but are more useful on their own (many defensive perks, like fortify or tac sense). Alternatively, if the almighty gods of balance demand it, one of the trees could be ditched entirely, leaving just the one tree for the soldier's subclass.

Final Thoughts
I realize that this idea may not not be something the Long War crew has the time/resources/interest/whatever to implement. However, I am an experienced coder and while I have never done XCOM modding I could certainly implement it myself (once LW development is complete.) So, please, if you like this idea, feel free to contribute your suggestions, whether they be solutions for the three issues outlined above (balance, meta-gaming, two perk trees) or simply your idea of a cool subclass. If we're really lucky, Pavonis will like the idea too and maybe even put it in, and even if not, I can use your suggestions when I mod it in myself.

In any case, if you've made it this far, thanks for reading this veritable novel :D
Bu6613man
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2017 11:44 pm

Re: Idea for making AWC perks more fun and balanced

Post by Bu6613man »

Hi! Great post. It's super exciting to see the potential for someone to mod the AWC. It's definitely one of my favorite parts of the game. I've spent a lot of time thinking about the AWC, and I think it is perhaps one of the more enjoyable mechanics. Building soldier with special & individually-selected perk options allows soldiers to be truly unique. But I certainly understand your dissatisfaction with the current system.

I think your idea has the potential to be really really cool. Seeing that a soldier has rolled to become, say a Rogue Assault could be a really awesome moment, and inform his whole build. My favorite thing about playing with revealed AWC perks is that I can build soldiers to utilize their individual advantages. (Retraining to take advantage of AWC's is virtually unfeasible at almost any rank.)

A few sticking points jump out immediately. Pistol perks are absolutely relevant to this discussion, because they are what your subclasses are competing with. Currently, some perks are absolutely worthwhile to train, and the decision between them and pistol perks is difficult. Some skills are trash, and once you see them, you know if you trained them you'd be wasting valuable AWC time that could be training pistol perks.

The very best AWC skills are always augmenting skills. Skills that make a soldier better at what they are already good at. That's part of what makes pistol perks so good. Often times they are easy additions on top of a soldier's skill set (Run and Gun is the obvious example). This makes for a tricky design space. Soldiers with subclasses that clash with their purpose would probably entirely ignore their AWC perks. And soldier with subclasses dedicated to what they are good at would have too easy a decision on what to choose. You might be able to make some subclasses train faster. I'de be much happier to see a lobber assault (a normally sub-optimal combination in my opinion) if I knew he'd have a faster training time on those perks.

I like the idea of subclasses having a range of say 5 or 6 different perks possible. Maybe with the last one always guaranteed. This could solve your visibility problem. Heck, you could even double down on the gambling, and make it so that only the final perk is visible, and you don't know exactly what you are training, except that it is part of the subclass. For example take your Marksmen subclass:

Marksman Perk List:

Damn Good Ground
Executioner
Center Mass
Deadshot
Precision Shot

AWC Visibility:
Level 1: Random from perk list = ?
Level 2: Random from perk list = ?
Level 3: Hunter's Instinct
DaviBones
Posts: 75
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 8:30 pm

Re: Idea for making AWC perks more fun and balanced

Post by DaviBones »

Hey Bu6613man, thanks for your post! I really like your ideas for the structure of subclasses, one subclass-defining perk at the end of each tree, with a pool that is chosen from randomly. I'd like to keep the hidden perk functionality as close to its current implement as possible, so I like the idea of having the first perk appear in several different subclasses. Lone Wolf, for instance, could appear in both the Skirmisher and Rogue subclasses, along with other subclasses which have yet to be created. This would make it easier to guess the subclass the farther you got into it, which I like -- more time investment, more information. As far as subclasses being more useful for certain classes, you are perhaps right, I was thinking that restricting each subclass to specific classes would solve that but given what you've said about pistol perks, it will require more thought than that.

Given how little attention this thread has received, I feel kinda embarrassed for thinking it might be a popular idea that gets incorporated into the base mod, which makes me kinda sad, as I would love to hear what johnnylump, the play-testers, and other experienced players thought about the balance of this idea. However, I am still more than willing to make a mod, but like I said in the OP, I have zero experience with XCOM modding, and therefore have no idea whether something like this is possible. I would assume so, given the breadth of the changes implemented by Pavonis, but again I just don't know for sure. If JL or someone else more informed than me could weigh in, I would be very appreciative.
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