okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

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Jackal
Posts: 147
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:10 pm

okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by Jackal »

I have asked vague questions before, but mainly they were vague because I wasn't sure enough to ask specific questions..

I want to have the highest ranking officers available in my havens as advisers

when I make my SSGT a officer, he's just 2nd Lieutenant or whatever the ranking changes

does that makes sense.. he's just a 1st Lieutenant like the Corporal I made a 2nd Lieutenant

I tired ranking them by clicking the word "rank" in the top left corner, but here are the two ways

ranking them from highest to lowest, with the highest starting first gets me this :

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z6oqmukk2cel9 ... P.rtf?dl=0


ranking them from lowest to highest, with highest at the bottom gets me this:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/okanbijg0t8ih ... M.rtf?dl=0


obviously i'm doing something terribly wrong...
Jackal
Posts: 147
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:10 pm

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by Jackal »

what is higher, corporal or 1st Lieutenant ??
JulianSkies
Posts: 301
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:17 am

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by JulianSkies »

Jackal wrote:what is higher, corporal or 1st Lieutenant ??
For this game, those are two entirely separate ranks.
You have a "base rank" based on the number of abilities you learned, those use sergeant naming schemes.
You have an "officer rank", which is an additional on top of your base rank, based on the number of officer abilities you learned. Those use officer naming schemes.

Ordering by rank actually orders by "base rank", or number of abilities learned, not by "officer rank". While that makes absolutely no sense on an everyday logic stance, it does make logical sense when you realize you're ordering by "number of class perks learned" instead of "rank" since that is what rank means at first.
Zyxpsilon
Posts: 274
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 1:26 am

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by Zyxpsilon »

IIRC.. the Ranking parser takes more than just their respective levels into account -- it also compiles the kills values to determine the "correct" slot for the pseudo-best versus anyone else with whatever lower combat results.

This is more obvious within the order given to your three US & followed by the Brit. Soooo -- ARNOLD must have more kills than BENNETT.. even though GREEN is still @2ND-LT (with less Kills than both!).

I accidentally realized these parsing variations when i had the oldish SMTP mod (with LW2) active since it actually provided the exact real kill counts right underneath the LW Barracks list style. The mystery values popped up to my face & solved that slot allocation weirdness for good! :)

PS; There might be other factors at work.. but that's what i found so far.
ginyu549
Posts: 26
Joined: Sat Apr 29, 2017 3:58 pm

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by ginyu549 »

Jackal wrote: I want to have the highest ranking officers available in my havens as advisers
OK, looking at that question it does appear a little confusing in the game.

What you really mean is that you want the person who will have the best chances of recruiting and finding faceless right?

Because I think by rank, even a second lieutenant will "outrank" a Master Sergeant. That's just the way military rank works. You can have a seasoned veteran sergeant under the command of a newbie second lieutenant who went to officer school but knows very little about real battle.

So really you want the most "experienced" soldier, not necessarily the highest ranked soldier (I think).

By default there isn't an easy way to see this I don't think. You'd have to look at each soldier individually to figure it out, look at their xp and kills and number of perks and see who had more.

I use this mod: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f ... =638033313 to help me see things like that at a glance without having to click into each soldier. Maybe that will help?

However I think the correct way to really figure it out is to just use the regular ranks from leveling up to rank the soldier, and then add half an additional rank for each officer rank that soldier has.

So normal order would be:
Squaddie > Lance Corporal > Corporal > Sergeant > Staff Sergeant > Tech Sergeant > Gunnery Sergeant > Master Sergeant

But then there would be steps in between each one depending on how many officer ranks they had. + 1/2 rank per officer rank. So theoretically a corporal that was trained up to a first lieutenant should be the equivalent of a Sergeant in terms of finding haven missions and recruiting etc... While a corporal trained up to a second lieutenant would be between corporal and sergeant. I don't code dive, so if someone has deeper knowledge of this please correct me, but I believe that's how it works?

Again, it could be easier to see in the interface, it is really a chore to figure that out. So much clicking....

Good thing I don't pay that much attention to it. Especially early in the game I found faceless easy enough, some of my haven advisers leveled up to master sergeant just from faceless hunting by the end of the game.

Then there was West Africa... I think there were 8 faceless in one mission (about mid-game) and I only had a squaddie adviser with Kevlar and an assault rifle with 2 rebels. Just left that haven empty for a while after that...R.I.P.

At any rate, I understand the desire to micro-manage, especially early, but don't worry about it too much, you should be fine with any suitably high ranking soldier you want in there.

Also, you're not dumb, it really isn't especially easy to understand IMO.
Tuhalu
Posts: 433
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:02 pm

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by Tuhalu »

Here's the numbers that affect how fast a Soldier detects Faceless.

Regular: Squaddie 5, Lance Corporal 10, Corporal 15, Sergeant 20, Staff Sergeant 22.5, Tech Sergeant 25, Gunnery Sergeant 26, Master Sergeant 27
Psi: Initiate 6, Acolyte 12, Adept 20, Disciple 25, Mystic 30, Warlock 35, Magus 40, Master 45
Officer: Second Lieutenant 2.5, First Lieutenant 5, Captain 7.5, Major 10, Lieutenant Colonel 12, Colonel 14, Field Commander 15

Add the Regular or Psi Rank to the Officer Rank to find how good the soldier is at detecting faceless.

And here's the numbers for how much soldier ranks affect recruiting speed.

Code: Select all

; Flat bonus to recruit for soldiers. Multiplier is special (see LWRebelJobIncomeModifier_SoldierLiaison)
SOLDIER_LIAISON_FLAT_BONUS=3
[LW_Overhaul.LWRebelJobIncomeModifier_SoldierLiaison]
; Multiplier for recruitment by soldier liaisons = (1.0 + SOLDIER_LIAISON_RANK_MULTIPLIER * rank)
SOLDIER_LIAISON_RANK_MULTIPLIER=0.05f
Jackal
Posts: 147
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:10 pm

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by Jackal »

thanks for the input guys...

just to be clear though... there is no way to see their rank :
Squaddie > Lance Corporal > Corporal > Sergeant > Staff Sergeant > Tech Sergeant > Gunnery Sergeant > Master Sergeant

once it is covered up by their officer rank


not complaining, btw, because i am SO appreciative of all the help you guys are willing to offer, but no commented on how the rank parsing changes when you sort from top to bottom instead of opposite to top:

i should just be the opposite order, but it isn't

that doesn't make sense to me... please try it in your games.

thanks again


for you advisors that have helped me get this far, i am about to do a tower mission on my second haven... the damn thing bumped from an Advent level of 2 to 3 as I was infiltrating, but I am about to run the mission now.. it's LIGHT! WHOOO HOOOO

My first have still has the HQ and is at ADVENT 10 so it may never get run.... just have 4 rebels doing intel and the rest in hiding.

off to kill shit
JulianSkies
Posts: 301
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:17 am

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by JulianSkies »

Jackal wrote:thanks for the input guys...

just to be clear though... there is no way to see their rank :
Squaddie > Lance Corporal > Corporal > Sergeant > Staff Sergeant > Tech Sergeant > Gunnery Sergeant > Master Sergeant

once it is covered up by their officer rank


not complaining, btw, because i am SO appreciative of all the help you guys are willing to offer, but no commented on how the rank parsing changes when you sort from top to bottom instead of opposite to top:

i should just be the opposite order, but it isn't

that doesn't make sense to me... please try it in your games.

thanks again


for you advisors that have helped me get this far, i am about to do a tower mission on my second haven... the damn thing bumped from an Advent level of 2 to 3 as I was infiltrating, but I am about to run the mission now.. it's LIGHT! WHOOO HOOOO

My first have still has the HQ and is at ADVENT 10 so it may never get run.... just have 4 rebels doing intel and the rest in hiding.

off to kill shit
Looking over your screenshots again (first answer was on mobile and on the road, bad time to answer) it seems like you didn't really change the sorting to be reversed by rank? Look at the arrow at the top left by the "Rank" word, it's pointing same direction on both cases, meaning you did not really apply the ordering you wanted to at all. I'm not sure what you did.
Jackal
Posts: 147
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:10 pm

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by Jackal »

JulianSkies wrote:
Jackal wrote:thanks for the input guys...

just to be clear though... there is no way to see their rank :
Squaddie > Lance Corporal > Corporal > Sergeant > Staff Sergeant > Tech Sergeant > Gunnery Sergeant > Master Sergeant

once it is covered up by their officer rank


not complaining, btw, because i am SO appreciative of all the help you guys are willing to offer, but no commented on how the rank parsing changes when you sort from top to bottom instead of opposite to top:

i should just be the opposite order, but it isn't

that doesn't make sense to me... please try it in your games.

thanks again


for you advisors that have helped me get this far, i am about to do a tower mission on my second haven... the damn thing bumped from an Advent level of 2 to 3 as I was infiltrating, but I am about to run the mission now.. it's LIGHT! WHOOO HOOOO

My first have still has the HQ and is at ADVENT 10 so it may never get run.... just have 4 rebels doing intel and the rest in hiding.

off to kill shit
Looking over your screenshots again (first answer was on mobile and on the road, bad time to answer) it seems like you didn't really change the sorting to be reversed by rank? Look at the arrow at the top left by the "Rank" word, it's pointing same direction on both cases, meaning you did not really apply the ordering you wanted to at all. I'm not sure what you did.


doh... resending
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nick_abbott
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Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by nick_abbott »

I'm ex-US Army and ranks were as follows:

Enlisted Ranks: Privates and NCOs Non Commissioned Officer.

Private: Trainee. Boot camp.
Private second class. First promotion.
PFC Private first class. Basic soldier rank of the army.

Specialist: (Some type of technical or other training. Same pay as a Corporal but not as much leadership responsibility).
Corporal. Beginning of the NCO ranks. Non-commissioned officers. Can be found as fire team leaders.

SGT Sergeant. Leadership role. In charge of privates, specialists and corporals. Fire team leaders.
SSGT Staff Sergeant. Holds a larger range of responsibilities over men and equipment then the SGT/Buck Sergeant.
SFC Sergeant first class. Platoon Sergeant. Delegates responsibilities to Staff Sergeants.

MSGT Master Sergeant. Often found as staff NCOs at the battalion level.
1SGT First Sergeant. Company level NCO. The entire unit is directly affected by the First sergeant in one way or another. A good first sergeant makes a huge difference to a unit.

SGM Sergeant Major. Top of the enlisted ranks of the US Army. They have 25 to 30 years of experience and often excels at their positions. I have never seen a Sergeant Major that did not shine in appearance and attitude. They are often the direct liaison between mid to higher level officers and all the enlisted men in their units. They hold responsibilities for every enlisted man in their unit from privates to master sergeants.
CGM Command Sergeant Major. Same as the Sergeant but with a promotion. These guys are the top of the chain and hold wide ranging responsibilities over every enlisted man in their unit. Officers often rely heavily on the Sergeant Majors experience and expertise. They are highly respected.
Command Sergeant Major of the Army. Their is only one at a time in the entire army. He is in charge of every enlisted man in the army and is attached to the Army Chief of Staff in Washington DC.

Officer Ranks. Commissioned Officers.
2LT Second Lieutenant. Entry level officer rank. Platoon level leader.

1LT First Lieutenant. Platoon level leader. Often leading a specialist platoon such as a weapons platoon or responsibilities at the Company level and known as the XO. Second in command of the Company.

CPT. Captain: Company level command. Battalion level staff officer. Captains can also be found at many teaching assignments in the US Army heading up schools or departments.

MA. Major: Staff Officer, Brigade level. Can hold a command in some circumstances.

LTC. Lt. Colonel: Battalion level command. Lt. Colonel or (Light) Colonel also XO positions at brigade level.

Col. Colonel: Brigade level commander. Also holds stall level positions at divisional level.

BG. Brigadier General: Division level deputy commander. Often responsible for leading the commanding general's staff.

LTG. Lieutenant General: Army Corps command level officers. Fort commanders.

GEN. General who commands a geographical area. Such as the Middle east, Afghanistan, NATO etc.

GOA: General of the Army. 5 star General appointed only in wartime to enable US officers to hold command over generals from other nations.

This information is all taken from memory and some changes may have occurred over the years that I am unaware of. But I am confident that the above is accurate enough to be worthwhile.
Jackal
Posts: 147
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:10 pm

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by Jackal »

JulianSkies wrote: Looking over your screenshots again (first answer was on mobile and on the road, bad time to answer) it seems like you didn't really change the sorting to be reversed by rank? Look at the arrow at the top left by the "Rank" word, it's pointing same direction on both cases, meaning you did not really apply the ordering you wanted to at all. I'm not sure what you did.

Here's the corrected post

not complaining, btw, because i am SO appreciative of all the help you guys are willing to offer, but no commented on how the rank parsing changes when you sort from top to bottom instead of opposite to top:

i should just be the opposite order, but it isn't

that doesn't make sense to me... please try it in your games.

thanks again


this are my highest soldiers, Calvin, Noah, Holly ranking high to low starting at the top (see arrow facing down at top left of screen in picture)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xjcwiacxr71d4 ... p.rtf?dl=0

this is the highest soldiers, Noah, Calvin, Lisa, ranking high to low, starting from the bottom (see arrow facing up at top left of screen)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/d0s3n9jb9tkmy ... M.rtf?dl=0
LordYanaek
Posts: 940
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 1:34 pm

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by LordYanaek »

To put it simply :
  • Normal rank (squaddie → MSgt) is just soldier "level". Squaddie is your level 1 guy and MSgt your level 8 (max). It tells you how powerful that soldier is.
  • Officer rank is the "real" rank telling who commands the squad. It doesn't make your guy stronger but gives them a few utility abilities to help the rest of the squad. A Cpl soldier who got promoted to 1st lieutenant is still a "level 3" soldier when considering his general power but he got special training to shout louder than others, putting him in charge ;)
Unfortunately, once a soldier is an officer there is no easy way to tell his "level". You have to open his Armory screen and look at his abilities.
Zyxpsilon
Posts: 274
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 1:26 am

Re: okay, Soldier Ranking, I ADMIT IT, I'M DUMB & LOST

Post by Zyxpsilon »

To make it even clearer that the Boot State (upon which soldiers get initially listed in the Barracks) has an impact on how the parsing results give specific ordering pattern within Ranks & under which slots they were booted in...

Image

This snapshot offers a solid proof of that principle. Just watching the whole bunch of GSGT(s) & COL(s) and how they all kept their initial states really makes it more obvious! ;)

Stargate + Fantastic/4 + XCom + Weyland/Yutani (as flags)... were selected as is with the "SelectStartingSoldiers" mod and thus followed throughout every gameplay events that caused the usual rank-up variations.

AND -- Ripley (COL) certainly has more XP than Bishop (GSGT) while (Stargate's) Carter has less than Jaffa even though they both nearly kept their Boot-States!!
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