What am I doing wrong - or is this normal

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troche58
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2023 11:23 pm

What am I doing wrong - or is this normal

Post by troche58 »

I'm playing on easy mode and as near as I can tell I'm miles ahead of all the other factions. I have all of North America, all of Europe (and I mean ALL of it) and Russia. I have something like 450 CP and they are strong nations. My research is double what any other faction has.

The issue is it is nearly 2041 and still nothing happening. Maybe I didn't take good research route but I still haven't unlocked Colony Core or Ring Core and I just finally unlocked a drive that could get enough Delta-V to travel to other planets.

I'm currently researching "Wormholes" as a campaign objective. I assume at some point I will take the fight to aliens. Maybe if I built a ton of ships with the new drive I unlocked I could fight them - as I probably have enough decent weapons and I unlocked "Ships of the Line" a long time ago.

BUT...I read that if you start generating too much MC the aliens should start attacking you (at least on normal difficulty)

My questions are:
1 is it normal to be this late in game before the action starts?
2 at what point do you start building defense and attack fleets and stop worrying about mc cap? I have used about 130 out of 240 mc - which doesn't seem like a lot of room to build an attack fleet anyhow
skaurus
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2023 8:59 pm

Re: What am I doing wrong - or is this normal

Post by skaurus »

You've answered yourself basically. Easy mod.

I play on veteran so usually by 2035 (even earlier) you have to have shipyards rdr to pop defence fleets around earth, Mars and Mercury. That is if you play slow, pro guys by this time have Jupiter moons and fleets good enough to kick aliens anywhere. I like Earth-stage game too much so I extend it to the max. I guess easy mod can last you way over 2040+ without total war.

About research you probably did what I did in the beginning, using you science on too many usless project (or the ones which get obsolete soon after you research them), pick you projects carefully. E.g in my first games I've researched ALL the missiles projects instead of just one...

If you pick wormholes tech already you had to kill>catch Alien already. This means you are progressing fine, it just take some more time on easy before Aliens get angry.

About your CP use, 450 at 2041 on easy seems like not much, thats what you suppose to have at 2030. But ofc this game has insane learning curve, we've all been there. Your MC use on easy can go way over 130, on this lvl of difficulty its basically free to use, on veteran you cannot go over 60 if you want to keep Mars mining industry running and smash Servants/Protectorate to the ground or mess with alien agents. I dont like trade my stations when I clean Earth form Servants scum.

To sum up, play normal or higher and by 2035 you'll see some action.
Last edited by skaurus on Fri Jan 27, 2023 11:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
actually-a-cat
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2023 11:20 pm

Re: What am I doing wrong - or is this normal

Post by actually-a-cat »

If by easy mode you mean Cinematic difficulty, on it aliens are set to ignore you until you attack them directly. There is a mechanic that makes aliens angry as your MC use increases, but this happens more slowly on lower difficulties, and on Cinematic it's effectively entirely disabled. So, it's normal as in it's not broken, but not normal as in it's not the default experience. Using 130 MC would guarantee war with the aliens on any difficulty higher than Cinematic (without techs that mitigate this). Also, independently of that, on higher difficulties by 2041 you'd be dealing with significant alien-related problems on Earth's surface.

Also contributing to pacing issues probably is that your research output seems to be very low, if you're still researching tier 3 habitats and story objectives in 2041. That's not necessarily an obstacle to winning, especially on Cinematic, but it would explain why things feel slow. (Comparing to other factions is not a good benchmark for how well you're doing because AI is incapable of developing their research. For reference, I loaded up a recent 2037 save to check, and my research output is 31 times higher than the next highest faction, at 1.5k per day.)

I usually breach hate MC cap and permanently go to war with aliens around 2030, but it's reasonable to put it off a lot longer than that, and possible (while not easy or optimal) to do it a lot earlier, by 2025-26.
rookie.one
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2017 6:08 pm

Re: What am I doing wrong - or is this normal

Post by rookie.one »

troche58 wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:25 pm BUT...I read that if you start generating too much MC the aliens should start attacking you (at least on normal difficulty)
For more detailed info on MC cap vs alien hate read this (the spoiler part):
https://hoodedhorse.com/wiki/Terra_Invicta/Diplomacy

Basicly what that mechanic does is providing a baseline for alien hate vs your faction. Other actions (assasinate, detain, purge, coup,...) vs. aliens and servants/protectorate will add additional hate until the aliens will retaliate (usually by bombarding your mines or going for your stations). The alien hate cap for retaliation is 50 meaning that all 5 slots of the alien hate bar (above your quick select for councilors, armies, habs, etc) are filled.

As you are playing on easy (think what you mean is cinematic) the multiplier for alien hate is so low, that it will NEVER (or hardly ever) effect you (1000 used MC for alien hate to reach war stage).
troche58 wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:25 pm My questions are:
1 is it normal to be this late in game before the action starts?
No. There are strategies where you will go to war with the aliens late (decent fusion drive with phasers and plasma weapons) and with recent changes to the game will result in a similar timing, but im guessing you are way off from that.

My guess is that you made some mistakes in the research along the way by:
-focusing too much on Council Engineering projects and not pushing global research enough
-you don't need to research every drive tech, just focus on a few selected ones (early game: pulsar, lars, maybe grid, forget the rest). Same goes for weapon tech: research what you need to equip your Point defence arrays / Layered Defense Arrays, and forget the rest until you reach a tech level you feel comfartable with engaging the aliens
-space based research is the key: on normal and below that is 8 earth orbitals with 5 of each research center (for the bonuses, like sociel science research center, xeno, etc.) + maybe a couple of research campuses; with that you can focus on researching the more expensive techs (ring stations/ habs, nuclear fusion in space)
-focusing on social science research and information science research also helps a lot (incresing your CP cap, thus letting you aquire more ground based research / MC); 650 Control points by 2032 is what I would consider as normal and propably 900 by 2040
troche58 wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:25 pm 2 at what point do you start building defense and attack fleets and stop worrying about mc cap? I have used about 130 out of 240 mc - which doesn't seem like a lot of room to build an attack fleet anyhow
You build early 2 ships (gunship/escort to survive and a monitor equipped with any missile system you get from researching missile warfare doctrine to trade) to destroy 1 alienship early on for the technology. aside from the monitor requiring a decent missile system those ships can be equipped with hydrogen rockets.

For defensive fleets some key technologies you will want to have are green arc lasers and a decent drive (pulsar, lars). With that you can basicly start building defensive fleets that are able to positively trade; or you can wait till you have z-pinch fusion tech green phasers and coil/plasma weapons to outright beat up the aliens.

for the MC strength of your fleets: more earth based control points -> more earth based MC + some space based MC -> enough to engage

for your current save: if you aren't on a beta build (.49 should be the realease channel), start by building a couple of battleships (2x 1slot nose laser, 2x point defense, 2x 2slot kinetic weapon, spiker, slush tankage, ecm and heat sink) and see where that gets you.
troche58
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2023 11:23 pm

Re: What am I doing wrong - or is this normal

Post by troche58 »

Wow, there must be steep learning curve if I'm expected to have 650 CP by 2032! I would love to watch playthrough of how that is accomplished. Sounds like I do not have anywhere near enough orbital research centers so maybe that was my downfall. And here I thought being ahead of AI was a good sign, but apparently not.

I appreciate all the feedback and will try again and see if I can avoid useless tech's and ramp up my CP's and research and maybe game will get more exciting
rookie.one
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2017 6:08 pm

Re: What am I doing wrong - or is this normal

Post by rookie.one »

Don't worry too much. You are still ahead in your run. Finish it, and before starting the next read up a bit on game mechanics on the official wiki (https://hoodedhorse.com/wiki/Terra_Invi ... victa_Wiki) and take a closer look at the research tech tree.

Considering the replays of playthroughs, you might want to take a look here:
PerunGaming/Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPYJii ... /playlists

Don't expect to achieve those timings as a) he is a very experienced player and b) those runs were recorded on earlier game versions and to some extend aren't possible anymore.
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